dangerous and much a threat to interpretation as being too starry-eyed cynicism, and a kind of unthinking blanket skepticism and a kind of juvenile rejection of any figure of authority as being bad because he or she is a figure of authority, is this limited a fission as hagiography or hero worship and is no more sophisticated even though sometimes it's sort of dark and. ..

>> his bodyguard was so stunned at first by the news he turned to look but dad was not in the seat anymore

be saw pandemonium looking for an exit. i wanted to show tads reaction that john wilkes bruce one of the worst people that ever lived but i thought it was important to connect the audience to a terrible personal sense of loss was no more heartbreaking figure that and tad who died from him but it to a kim about 10 years to do it. >> but that is up part that i thought was so ironic that he sought that fantasy that

day. >> something that came up the ending of the film the last scenes with tad id -- tad and abraham lincoln that the flag never would have touched the ground but some have thought it would have ended just before that. what is the collaboration to bring those scenes together? >> i thought it was important to show the assassination have been but not a good idea to end with him walking into the "twilight" what i find obnoxious but every emetine said reconstruction will be

harder than the civil war but i did not want the approach boardwalks off into glory. the was murdered by a lunatic. the loss of abraham lincoln is a catastrophe of its imponderable proportion. i also thought i wanted to make sure somewhere in the movie like i said the greatest political speech ever made and the president of great triumph says we may pay their horrendous price price, not because god is on our side or their site, but we have all benefited -- benefited we may shed blood and lose our wealth to

correct the imbalance as a consequence it is stunning to speak that kind of truce and at this point* ready to celebrate victory. that is the way it ended i am happy the inaugural address did. here broadens the horizon into a global scene. >> i would love for this to be a trilogy. will there be a prequel? >> is still day-lewis' ever wanted to do anything more, i would drop everything. having said that, i feel i

can imagine in my lifetime there will be another step performance of lincoln comparable to daniel. i cannot imagine why this firework on a dramatic figure and i suspect to daniel did what he came to do in this movie and maybe i'm wrong and maybe he will sign for a series next week but we are happy with what we did. >> the filming richmond and various places, the office where was that filled? >> yes. the state capitol in richmond as most of the movie was. off on one side in a conference room.

they mated desk -- made a desk. >> it looks like the treasury department before mary was kicked out into looked just like his oval office overlooking the executive mansion. >> we shot nothing in washington d.c. >> that is a great door. it was propped up against the statute of robbery e. lee taking command of the confederate army. >> you have that imposing statue everywhere. >> but the rotunda is the only statue for which washington actually posed so the value is beyond

imagination. they put chicken wire around it but people we're going by it was like grand central station said it would be white knuckles every time would switch shots and it scared to death we would knockoff of washington said it. >> we did not get to all of the questions. thank you for participating we will try to get your next questions. thank you for being with us live. if you are in c-span or highland park figure for joining us and those who came to be a part of us as well. also your publishers and your support helps the

public bringing great authors like this. >> this bookstore which i discovered a few years ago is a national treasure and enormously important. i am thrilled we got to do this here. >> you heard gramm smith was here for abraham lincoln vampire hunter andrews said i need to follow that up. >> that is where i got the idea to launch here. [laughter] >> i think the staff and without you we could not make these shows success to. [applause]

>> thank you very much it is the pleasure to be here, i am honored to deliver the lecture. my greatest books, i have to confess it is my only book. [laughter] i spent 30 years going to saudi arabia as day editor talking to officials about

oil, iraq, iran, u.s., geopo litical issues. when i return all -- retired from the "journal" one thing i was interested in doing with my new found time was trying to understand saudi society. what did the society looks like? how did they look at their rulers, us? as i speak about saudi arabia people constantly ask me why did you do that? why did you spend five years going bear dressed -- they're dressed in black.

my editors said why did you do this? i said because of interest be. she said paris is interesting. [laughter] why did you do this? may meander stand that was her own the editing point*. so i will try to make you understand why i found it both fascinating and important. saudi arabia is probably the strangest country will never see. it is so different from our own. a woman never reaches the age of maturity, she is always under the control of some man. she cannot go to her son's school she cannot see her son graduate.

she obviously doesn't drive drive, we know that and does not appear in public without being covered and with the worst situations, it just chattel for a man to do as he wishes. that is not the normal but it does happen. religiously dominated that meant obey all lot and within zero bay men and of what is distant and men are at hand. it is less strange to me than most visitors because of my own background light matthew from the town of

alabama of 900 people for churches one plinking stoplight and no movie theaters. so legend is what people did. my father was far more conservative than the average person in the town we were not permitted to wear pants, shorts, no alcohol, no dancing, no musical instruments in our church of christ. soap in lots of ways i was guided home in saudi arabia for i tried to figure this country out precisely because it is the one country that is truly strategic that only because

it is the world's largest exporter of oil which sustains the western way of life but saudi arabia i am convinced will be critical in the altman resolution of what is the proper issam between the radical jihad best and the more modernizing thought san that battle goes on in saudi arabia. to try to understand this society it is like somebody coming here to right to a book about america you could not go to washington or new york and claimed to understand america. i knew i had to get out of riyadh and that was

permitted i went all over the country by saw all kinds of people the royal family but very poor people, and then, women, old people and it was in advantage to be a woman because you could talk to both a western woman in saudi arabia is basically an honorary man. men are prepared to talk to you even the senior religious officials who believe it is wrong to be in the presence of a woman who was not your relative. in the beginning i had a one month, one entry visa and i

got a three month e. said then i was given a five-year multiple injury be said then i came and went as they chose i did not have to deal with the government. i would use a cellphone and a hired car from the hotel and would get friends to pass me to other people. my a gold was not to prescribe what it ought to be like the to understand and describe what it was like. want to talk first observations of saudi society and second with they may portend and then about scenarios of u.s. policy makers that may include you in the audience.

saudi society, it should not have surprised me but it is much more diverse than rethink people live westernize negative -- at westernized and it is also more divided than i realized and much more dependent on government because most people work for the government. the divisions are quite deep not a country as more of the collection of tribes with the flag and / region region, religious sects /

gender and people have the deep distrust of each other and they don't mix much outside of their family i will show you my version of how we think society functions this is a saudi, this little figure here who is in such a family who is inside a tribe, inside a country ruled by the religious establishment, and all of that ruled in by the royal family. so it is quite constricted that the religious

establishment with judges -- legitimizes them to use them the good housekeeping seal of approval otherwise there would be another tribe, of the 250 years ago, there was a meeting one wanted to conquer arabia for the one true god feeling the area had strayed from the teaching of the profit and muhammed sad mood wanted to conquer it for himself so together they did concord arabia because it was more productive to fight in the name of god and saud is a that symbiotic relationship

has existed ever since. people live literally behind walls most people's homes are surrounded by walls 10 or 12 feet high and they lived inside higher walls figuratively. they are bound, i'd like a mummy in the bindings of tradition and religion so there is a rigidity that keeps people from having much independence or individualism. but the internet and social media and satellite tv are penetrating those walls and a big way. so young people and 60 percent of the population is sunday -- under 20 years

of age. so without knowing an impoverished saudi arabia the development was done in the '70s and '80s and as the population has exploded many services have deteriorated. young people do not have gratitude to the royal family they say why haven't you done more? they hear through the media and other versions of islam islam, so they are also learning to question as well as communicate witches a new scene in saudi arabia.

country exists on the three pillars of stability and all of those are cracking. religion is one of them and is almost impossible to imagine the omnipresence of religion. every shopping mall, airport has rows of prayer rugs with the direction of mecca properly pointed during the proper times of the day the shopping malls close everyone goes to pray and

and the parents were educated in the u.s. and they took me on a picnic in the desert there was a final prayer of the day. i was sitting on the rug and at the end of that the sexual son came to me and said i need to teach you something. you know, what to say when the angel of death comes? i did not. [laughter] he said to is your guide and you say allah. who is your profit and you say mohammed. what is your faith and you say is long. what your works you say i heard and i believed and muslims apparently believe this grave interview occurs

immediately after you are buried and if you are a good muslim and in answer the questions you are borne aloft and shown a window of heaven then put back in your grave to await judgment day. if you have not been of good muslim and cannot properly answer the questions, your pulverized am put back together and pulverized and put back together for eternity until the judgment day. so this little boy had learned this in school, not his parents might try to understand the mentality was a very conservative woman

making my father looks liberal and she's translated for me with the mothers and sisters and wife of the imam i asked if i could live with the week and she said yes. so she opened the gate and she said that is where she lives, meaning the first wife andrea went upstairs where this lady named lulu lived. when her husband came up every 24 hours, i had to hide in my room because obviously he was not supposed to encounter, he knew i was there, but could not encounter a woman who was not a relative.

she had a television but they only got the religious channels which does not allow any women because the saudi state tv does have when in with heads covered the faces uncovered and she's that that was totally improper. i am convinced she wanted to convert me and spent a lot of time. the first thing she took out the family computer and dialed up a you to get a video, the six episodes by a fundamentalist preatally improper. i am convinced she wanted to convert me and spent a lot of time. the first thing she took out the family computer and dialed up a you to get a video, the six episodes by a fundamentalist preacher in texas. she had done her homework. [laughter] who had converted to islam and when that did not lead to a conversion she called her brother over and i read

dacron three times during the five-year period because it was great fun to discuss religion. with this new information young people and old people have access to with the religious establishment that is increasingly seen by religious people like her. doing the willis king abdallah rather than allah and to build a of a new university of science and technology that mixes saudi men and women but with infidel men and women from all over the world and when

when of the scholars he said it is wrong and sicking fired them but not surprisingly, many of the others began to discover their profit had his hair washed by women and other things that made this okay. so people see the double standard and undermines the credibility of the religious establishment those who don't mind the mixing but if

the king can get the religious do this then why not when they're driving or whatever? the second pillar of stability in the kingdom is obviously the oil well. that buys acquiescence if not loyalty to the government and royal family. 90 percent of the treasury in saudi arabia comes from oil wells. that does not tax people because here we have no taxation without representation and there is no representation without taxation and the royal family does not tax is a you don't get the representation.

but loyal funds the jobs of the saudis and most out -- all saudis worked for the government. 90% of those in the private sector are foreigners. there are 19 million saudis and 9 million foreigners in the kingdom. because energy is subsidized and has now become a subject in the saudi press what will happen if we continue to use more and we have less to export and their exports that fund the lifestyle, it is possible the government will find a way we will cut

the subsidies but in the post tear of spring environment they're not inclined to take things from people and the country has $500 billion of foreign reserves so it is hard they broke. but institutions estimate the government spending will exceed revenue by 2014. after the air of spring when abdallah came home from back surgery he passed out $130 billion to society on top of $180 billion annual budget more money for student stipends to the religious establishment establishment, more money to everyone to create a minimum wage for the first time for

saturday's the foreigners and lastly the royal family itself the third pillar of stability which is weakening, the biggest internal issue is that aged and infirm leadership. this leadership -- leadership declared 1930 to buy saud when he died 1953 the crown past to his eldest son then brother, a half-brother, a half-brother soaking abdullah is the office of the voice and see old man had 44 sons, a 22 why san 36 lived to

adulthood but now they are elderly, the king is 90 and he has already lived in only seven years, a two of his brothers of the crown prince. it is very reminiscent of the old soviet union when brezhnev was dyed and replaced and then died in then replaced in died quickly and then was finally replaced by gorbachev but by then it was too late to save the system. as ronald reagan said at that time there were three soviet leaders in a little over three years time they keep dying on me. [laughter] that is what president obama

and future american presidents will deal with certain the in the next four years they have no ability to agree on the son of one of the brothers the 36 branches each year if my son gets it, let your whole branch is disenfranchised because we pass it down to our branch for it is easy brother to brother but which cousin when there are hundreds? the king tried to get around that with the allegiance council with one person from every branch to decide when the first crown prince died that group met and one of the brothers said i should

be the next crown prince and the king said no. i am taking another brother and a that was the and of one man / one-vote. there was an expression and a decision. so young saudis to worry about what will happen in. with these cuts since quarrel with each other when the time comes because there are three basic units of the defense ministry, national guard and a huge interior operation that watches people to guard the oil facility. of lot of saudis fear some how each of those it is run by a prince to perhaps fight

with each other that is what brought down the second saudi state in the late 1890's. if you are a normal saturday you talk about plan b and most people don't know. there is a lot of nervousness, and frustration because this country has no experience whatsoever with self governance or individual responsibility or civil society, a few talk about democracy but someone to as they described as justice and they wanted government that is more

transparent, accountable, ru le of law where there are clear rules and enforced equally as it is often the case based on who you are. this brings me to what could have been. obviously one scenario is the continuation of the status quo because they cannot bring themselves to agree on a young bird leader yet to although many of them say there past to be changed

so the status quo is the easiest and the risk is further economic stagnation and more unemployment. unemployment among young men is roughly 40% 40% of people live on less than $1,000 per month. so the wilkes disparity is a source of thinker among saudis. and to open a bit with the risk of that it produces a backlash among the conservatives to you don't

want more changes and openness and the road to ruin with that backlash you could have the modernizers. they react to that backlash. censor it is getting a leader who decides the way to control this is to revert to their religiosity of the '80s and '90s after the attack on the mecca mosque they basically turned the country over and 20 years of that the terrorists that produced 911 so saudis understand that and to say

it could not happen again again, it is hard to entirely rule out. the fourth option is chaos that leads to a collapse sparked in tunisia, saudis are very passive but young people increasingly question why can't we have more? why does the royal family take more than their fair share? it may be as the royal family likes to say and as many believe the status quo will hold there are

predictions of the royal family that comes through i personally think it could be different because of the extra no pressure in the region against the status quo and the internal information and frustration and the royal family is in this very difficult transition period. i will close with my metaphor for this society which are used in the book of a 747 flying with the cockpit of:jerry hough -- geriatric prince who would be caving in and take over the cockpit and an economy fall of frustrated young people.

some islamic fundamentalists who want to turn the plane around to go back to the past and others who want to shoot the pilot and hijack the plane and it continues to fly losing the altitude and there may be somebody on the plane who could landed but it seems unlikely to get an opportunity. with that, i will take your questions. [applause] >> there will be a microphone so raise your hand. because of cnn we will be

sure you have the microphone when you start speaking and start with a student question. if you want to give a speech , see me afterwards but if you have a question this is a good time. >> teeeighteen thank you for today. i am a first-year student in grad school you deliberately intentionally went to saudi arabia to emerge self and culture something not many of us would have the opportunity to do. what if anything are they in the realm of public diplomacy for westerners to understand them? >> that is a good question.

i think they are giving a few tourist pieces, but not much. i dunno it may exist the student exchanges the u.s. brings them here on the state department jurors and i met a young man who had been very conservative confessed to beating up his brother for listening to music he was of sharia law graduate and came on line in an illegal tour of the u.s. and a complete lee changed his mind. it was the first time i ever knew that a woman could have her head uncovered and not

be a or. they have so many misconceptions like we do with them my first dinner with the imam family was very tense and his mother, his wife and six sisters and they basically asked me do you ever see your mother? they had this idea that american women are walking around if not half dressed in office and paying no attention to their parents or children. overtime they got past that but i am a big fan of exchanges in both directions but i do not know what they are doing to encourage

people. i don't think they encourage the average person to visit saudi arabia for. >> my impression the brand of islam practiced is more conservative than the rest of the muslim world. however they seem friendlier to the west and maybe it is the silk -- sale of oil but you spoke satin arabia spoke as a fusion between the saud family wanting to conquer the peninsula also wanting the same thing but my question is does religion need to be used by the modern saudi royal family to

control the population in the disingenuous way? or are they actually religious? >> that depends on the individual saturday but no question religion is used to control these society. the official position and what is preached repeatedly there are 70,000 mosques and there are no other organizations. the religious view is you must not cause chaos for good if you want to challenge something, do it privately. there is a whole islamic

debate what is the proper way to confront your leader but the fundamental view is you do not confront them with us on the big london said he is not a religious scholar but when he challenged the royal family in the '90s, his view was it is okay to call them out on not being properly religious , but it is not the comment you so they do put a straight jacket over people. the imam and mentioned, i spent a lot of time with.

he was very critical but when i asked him is it okay to confront your rulers, even he said no. because the feeder is of chaos cat -- causing a lack of community the community of believers to keep harmony there is important. if not real hard to eat it is pretend which is why people can do all kinds of things in their home from drinking alcohol to having dinner with with and they are not married to it is in

private it does not disrupt the harmony. after the norm that is what is bad. >> wills fargo or bank of america, how do they get the fdic? it is a regular bank they all go to or do they have american banks? >> did dutch bank, british bank, british, french, saudi banks and obviously for them, there is the need to purport to to be sure rya

correct to not earn interest and they have various ways and experts tell them how to do this and a religious find that is very inappropriate you are not supposed to mix or earn interest you are not supposed to have infidels in the country but the religious establishment approves the presence of troops in 1990 to have movie theaters on the university campus there is a mosque and theater side by side also won at aramco but the religious are not permitted inside the compound which

obviously is acceptable because they find not only the religion that the entire country and this is the deeply religious people who would like to have a genuine is gone back to the seventh century where the profit mohammed a. out of the communal plate. said of the divide in the country does get bigger as king of della has tried to do but giving scholarships to 140,000 saudis including women putting 30 women 150%

with the power of debate this is again there really conservative totally inappropriate thing for women to be separated, covered, it is not proper in their lanes as they do these things the opposition grows it is a tug of war and there is a fifth leader after the death of a hominid. and he lasted 20 years when all but one was killed by somebody rather quickly he

was asked how did you last so long? he said, and this is practiced by the royal family i hold a here between me and by people when they pull i yield and when they yield, high poll and that is exactly what happens when the pressure builds, the king passes out many or sends students abroad, if the pressure builds in the of the direction, these things can roll back as they did in the '80s. for instance they had the elections for municipal governments to wash away the 911 stain with the rest of the world women were not

permitted to vote but there was supposed to be another alexian 2009 and they were told maybe. when that came there was no election for anybody. then 2011 after the era of spring suddenly there was an election a proper for men but they need to give something well was promised but not given was then given so that is largely how things work. some say two steps forward one step back some say one step forward to steps back but it is a small margin for maneuver.

>> i am with communications and i had a chance. [inaudible] they're talking about the frustrations there are a lot of problems and any kingdom but then to talk about the kinks but to say he is bad

how would you sing? would that be a cushion to be complained for the future? >> what is the question? >> kings can be a cushion to relieve the frustration or they can be targeted for the future. >> does see a sort of frustration or a target? you are right to whoever the skiing is gonna even come players for the worst is he is surrounded by bad people who don't tell him what is going on, he is an old man and they never criticize him directly, almost never.

flicking is somebody that is all powerful if he chooses to be whenever he makes up his mind to do something, he does it like the university or there was a woman who was forcibly divorced from her husband by her brothers who insisted the father had never given permission then they wanted her to divorce. she refused to go home with her brothers said she insisted on staying in jail so she did for years. the case got a lot of publicity than decaying involve himself to getting ne